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Monday, 01 June, 2009

Quote Of The Day
(with comments)

Dave Leach, who puts out a newsletter called Prayer and Action News, comments on the shooting of George Tiller:

"To call this a crime is too simplistic. There is Christian scripture that would support this."


Permalink | Posted in General |
  1. By Y Nought. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @11:39am:
    I guess his point is that Christian scriptures ought to be criminalised. OK by me.
  2. By Torrey. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @11:48am:
    Bill Maher, who hosts a show called Real Time with Bill Maher, comments on the shooting of George Tiller:

    "To call this a crime is too kind. There is Christian scripture that would support this!"
  3. By BB. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @11:53am:
    I weep.
  4. By Rix. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @12:18pm:
    No surprise. There is Christian scripture that would support almost anything.
  5. By Shel-tone. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @12:25pm:
    "To call this a Christian scripture is too simplistic. There is crime that would support this."
  6. By tom. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @12:46pm:
    "Eternal suffering awaits anyone who questions God's infinite love." Bill Hicks
  7. By Tranjo. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @01:11pm:
    The question for Bill Maher is, "What Christian scripture supports an individual taking another individual's life for any reason without punishment?" What chapter and verse - be specific please. Capital punishment and war don't count - that is state-sanctioned killing and an entirely different issue.
  8. By Mike Woodhouse. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @01:14pm:
    So there's something scriptural that trumps Commandment #6? (or #5, apparently, if you're Catholic) Wow, that one must be a doozy.
  9. By Fast Eddie. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @01:25pm:
    Capital punishment and war don't count - that is state-sanctioned killing and an entirely different issue.


    So, how does "Thou shalt not kill" not fall into these?
  10. By Y Nought. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @01:37pm:
    #7 Tranjo the Barbarian: Capital punishment and war don't count - that is state-sanctioned killing and an entirely different issue.

    Does being "state-sanctioned" make it right? Does calling it "capital punishment" make it right? When you have a theocracy, "commanded by God" is the same as "state-sanctioned" and is therefore "capital punishment," even if it is for a minor offense like working on the sabbath (Exod 16:25-26,29, Exod 31:15, Exod 35:2 or disrespecting your parents(Exod 21:17, Deut 21:18-21).

    You are an evil person if you think that state entanglement in religiously motivated violence makes it acceptable.
  11. By Tranjo. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @01:47pm:
    Re: war and capital punishment - I never said it was acceptable, I only said it was a different issue than murder. I never said I supported war, capitol punishment, or murder - how does that make me a barbarian?
  12. By Y Nought. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @01:51pm:
    #7 Tranjo the Barbarian: Capital punishment and war don't count - that is state-sanctioned killing and an entirely different issue.

    Numbers chapter 31:17-18 "Now therefore kill every male among the little ones, and kill every woman that hath known man by lying with him. But all the women children, that have not known a man by lying with him, keep alive for yourselves."

    Hosea 13:16 "Samaria shall become desolate; for she hath rebelled against her God: they shall fall by the sword: their infants shall be dashed in pieces, and their women with child shall be ripped up."

    These are not acts of war, these are war crimes. If God commanded these, then God was wrong. If the state sanctioned these, then the state was wrong. And once again, in a theocracy, the religion and the state are the same, so your qualification is nothing but an attempt at trickery.
  13. By Curtis. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @02:05pm:
    A Pro-Lifer from Kansas Speaks on Tiller

    This does remind me so much of John Brown.
  14. By MT. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @02:09pm:
    actually, if being "state sanctioned" makes the action not 'count' as killing, there should be no problem. As of 1973, abortion is state sanctioned in the US, and therefore they don't "count" as killing either. QED

    This argument about 'killing' is pointless. The question is whether or not the thing growing is a human being.

    It's true that some human cells die in abortion. As did the ones removed from me when I had my more-or-less-healthy gall bladder removed. And if genetic research continues in it's current direction, those cells might have had the 'potential' to become a complete person if given the right conditions. That doesn't mean they should have the rights of humans.

    Having carried two of them, I think I'm qualified to say that the thing at 3 weeks was not a human, and the thing at 34 weeks was. There is no definite point in gestation at which the change occurs. Whatever time the legal system chooses will have to be a bit arbitrary.
  15. By killinchy. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @02:56pm:
    I think the "thou shall not kill" commandment referred only to killing other Jews.
  16. By Tranjo. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @03:08pm:
    I haven't heard the quote directly, but apparently Bill Maher said that "Christian scripture" supports going into a church and shooting someone to death. Did he make a specific reference or a general statement?

    For the record, personally I am against shooting people to death for any reason.
  17. By Curtis. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @04:05pm:
    I want to go on record as being for shooting some people to death with guns.
  18. By Shel-tone. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @05:30pm:
    I want to go on record as being against offending Curtis so much he shoots me with guns
  19. By anaceofkidneys. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @06:10pm:
    I hope, I hope, I hope you're comparing Tiller to John Brown and not the maniac who murdered him. Please tell me I read that right.
  20. By Barbwire. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @06:22pm:
    Jews say life begins with the first breath, as when God breathed life into the clay that became Adam. Therefore, a fetus which has never breathed cannot be alive. This is using their bible to show that you can make almost any point. Remember the old saw, "The devil can quote scripture to serve his purposes."? Religious fanatics will find any justification to perpetrate their atrocities.
  21. By Curtis. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @08:01pm:
    aaok -- No, I'm comparing the maniac to John Brown, but only for both their murderous righteous rage in the name of what both viewed as moral imperatives. I agree with John Brown's moral imperative and not the maniac's, but I consider John Brown a murderer.
  22. By Curtis. Comment posted 01-Jun-2009 @08:08pm:
    aaok -- here's a quote from a review of "Coudsplitter," Russell Banks's excellent novel about John Brown:

    The cover of Russell Banks's mountain-sized novel Cloudsplitter features an actual photo of Owen Brown, the son of John Brown--the hero of "The Battle Hymn of the Republic" whose terrorist band murdered proponents of slavery in Kansas and attacked Harpers Ferry, Virginia, in 1859 on what he considered direct orders from God, helping spark the Civil War.


    I agree with that.
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